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| Bryn Trefil |
Peter Hain predicts EU poll results will be 'terrible'
Well done Mr. Hain what a brilliant prediction
http://tinylink.com/?eH8k99Ov16 Really!!!!! We already knew that up here Labour didn't 
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| hedleymccarthy |
Peter Hain is probably right, although, Labour is well in front in Blaenau Gwent tonight. | ||||||||
| hedleymccarthy |
Looks like Labour, Plaid Cymru, UKIP, Conservatives, BNP, Liberals in that order in Blaenau Gwent.  For the moment 
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| Carolyn |
Very poor turn out by all accounts. One polling station only had four voters by 5 'oclock in the evening, that is the worst I have ever heard of. I know it was also very poor at ours. it does not really matter who wants to be in the front of a pantomime horse | ||||||||
| hedleymccarthy |
You would have had enough to say if we'd been the horse's backside
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| Saeson |
I didn`t know Euro results were broken down by Parliamentary constituency. I await full details of the BG vote with interest.
Most people don`t understand the EU or what it does; they just read the papers (so it must be true  ). I like the UKIP line - "we just want to trade with Europe". Yeah, until Europe says **** off. I`m sure Obama would come to our aid. 
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| Rocke |
Peter Hain probably once predicted that the Pope would be found to be a Catholic as well.
And Labour will probably claim that re-electing them will enable day to continue following night. btw 'hedleymccarthy', you're still posting without answering my questions, questions which as you'll have seen readers of this forum want answered. You wouldn't want me to do it for you would you ? |
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| Rocke |
btw - The Conservative Party polled the greatest number of votes in Wales.
That, I think, is the greatest insult to Labour and its junior partner Plaid Cymru that you could imagine. I wonder if Betfred will give us odds on Agent Smith losing his deposit - paid for from the affiliation fees etc. levied on those decent hard-working members. You know - the ones who told HQ not to parachute Maggie in here. Anyway, here's some Peter Hain-esque predictions from yours truly: 2009/10 - Dai Davies re-elected with even greater majority. 2011 - Trish Law, after surviving a potential clash with another anti-Labour candidate that might have split the vote, retains AM seat, seeing off another non-local candidate. Helped by yet another split in the local Labour party that saw a local candidate defeated in the party's run-off for selection. 2012 - absolute rock bottom. Labour support in Local Govt. elections disintegrates. The party returns less councillors than People's Voice, despite change of leadership in the last year of term and attempts to persuade the public that lessons have been learned. Former councillors indicate they will continue in public service ( last seen as guards on Ebbw Vale-Cardiff line, working in Ysbyty Aneurin Bevin or lecturing on 'The Great Industrial Struggles of the Working Classes in the South Wales Valleys' on the Learning Campus ). |
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| hedleymccarthy |
[quote="Saeson"]I didn`t know Euro results were broken down by Parliamentary constituency. I await full details of the BG vote with interest.
Labour had 34.8% of the vote, Plaid Cymru 15% UKIP 11% and the Tories 9% Liberals finished 6th behind the fascist party. 
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| Carolyn |
http://www.blaenau-gwent.gov.uk/d...ts_Governance/Euro09declareng.pdf
27.39% of registered electors |
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| Saeson |
Is that as in "you`ve got to or else you`ll " Not exactly the old days is it? And no People`s Voice to challenge them
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| Rocke |
[quote="hedleymccarthy"]
What about Barnsley ( isn't that Scargill country ? ) then ? Explain that one. This lot have messed up so much that decent people now feel they have to vote in a party that just about embodies everything this country has stood up to and fought against over the years. Just seen News at Ten. They visited a Welsh Workingmen's Club. I hope HQ were watching. Read the lips of those people Mr. Brown-nose. Anyway, can we have a percentage breakdown of use of the civic car(s) please ? The Freedom of Information Act beckons, I think. |
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| hedleymccarthy |
I am not really interested in responding to people using pseudonyms, however, I am intrigued that at first you bother to doubt that Labour walked it in Blaenau Gwent now you seem to be saying that the People's Voice are the antedote to Fascism or do you think that now Labour has become the underdog of British politics that Blaenau Gwent are ready to embrace them again? In fact what are you saying exactly and who cares anyway? |
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| Rocke |
Is that as in responding to people who use pseudonyms or responding to people by using a pseudonym ? Surprisingly we agree on one thing. What are you saying exactly and does any user of this forum really care anymore. I bet Agent Smith won't be talking down to people in that manner when he starts engaging 'the enemy' as Attack Sheep Dobbs calls us. For me the only interest now is to see the latest drivel spouted by whoever's pressed the keys of your pseudonym since I last looked. And come on, you just know I'm going to get the info. and publish it. How many trips has Cllr. McCarthy had in the civic car since last May ? |
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| Saeson |
Temper, temper. I think you`ll find that most people use a pseudonym on message boards. I use only the one (unlike some). There are some people who know who I am. That you are not one of them doesn`t bother me in the least, though it clearly irks you. I fail to see how you can crow when Labour only managed just over a third of the vote in what used to be one of their rock-solid seats and where the party (are they a party? who cares) who beat them at the last Parliamentary and Assembly elections did not field a candidate. And why would I think the People`s Voice the antidote to fascism. Who are these facists? The Tories? The Libs? Dear old Plaid? All viable alternatives to sad, saggy old Labour. And finally as for you caring, it is clear to all that you really don`t. Otherwise why would an elected public official feel the need to post the peurile yah-boo rubbish that you seem to revel in? You simply have not the slightest notion how unbelievably unprofessional it all is, do you? Though really I think you do and you have no intention of standing at the next local elections. Go out with a bang, eh? You should be ashamed of yourself. Or the real Hedley McCarthy should sue. |
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| Rocke |
I must say Saeson I thought twice about replying to 'hedleymccarthy's latest last night, thinking it better that you reply first.
Clearly though I didn't steal your thunder ! On the same subject has anyone seen the political map of Wales ( EU elections ) ? All the political pundits have been applying the results to what would happen in forthcoming elections etc. If Wales was a face it would have one stark feature - a great red blob near the bottom left of its chin. It's all that's left of Labour - the Valleys. What was that famous saying by our prince - something about 'monstrous carbuncles' wasn't it ? Mmm........ monstrous carbuncles and bottom left. Perhaps our resident Jeremiah will be interested in synonyms. |
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| blodwend |
i havent seen anything in the newspapers  my neighbour told me that labour had walked in.
why didn't Peoples Voice stand then ? i feel a bit let down by that and nobody seems very worried about those nazis getting in. isn't that scarey? |
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| martyn142 |
Very scary Blodwen
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| Carolyn |
I would not have said walked in as if it was an achievement to be proud of by any means. The turnout was very low, labour only had to get its firm party members, ex party members, councilors friends, supporters and relatives who are still clinging on to the old party ideals. Nobody else was going to turn out, I don't think this has been run as a separate poll before it was run the same day as the local elections last time I think even them many of the electorate had no clue what they were voting for it was just an extra ballot but made their choices since they were there anyway. I think the expences scandal had quite a big inmpact I know a lot of people who said they simply would not vote at all just as a protest they don't give a damned who gets in anymore.
The turnout on election days has been getter lower each year, many of the younger people and families just not interested and won't make the effort. The old labour dinosaurs are dying out, so many people following the 70'80' and 90's and young families have moved away since there is nothing in this valley to keep them here and no effort has been made to encourage manufacturing industry back to this area,it's all services and many a managers/administarors in the better jobs have come from outside the borough or left it, young people achieving good exam results have long gone perfereing to live in Cardiff or cities elsewhere. There has been a great increase of people moving into Blaenau Gwent for cheaper housing, especially Abertillery, nobody knows what their voting preferences are and most work elsewhere unless they are immigrants. Labour or any other party can't expect to sit on its backside in a shop or shoving a few (Too many) leaflets through doors to win peoples vote. It is back to knocking on doors, every door to win votes, being seen in the town regularly not just there is an election to be won, and not just drinking in the pubs |
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| blodwend |
these protest voters dont really think about what they are doing do they Martyn. hot heads who vote for anyone with a big mouth. i can't find much about ukip is it true that they are more conservative than the conservatives. well thats scarey as well isnt it ? |
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| IAN(boco)jones |
SURELY A NON VOTER IS MORE DAMAGING TO DEMOCRACY THAN A VOTER WHO EXERCISES THEIR RIGHT TO VOTE FOR WHO THEY PLEASE. PEOPLE ESPECIALLY WOMEN, DIED FIGHTING FOR THE RIGHT TO VOTE. BUT I DO AGREE THAT THERE IS NO ROOM IN POLITIC'S FOR THESE FACIST PARTIES. |
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| jools |
Can't believe almost a million voted for BNP, though apparantly they polled less overall votes than at the last euro elections. The erosion of the Labour vote pushed their % high enough to put MEPs in Brussels. Very scary. And also, their % vote decreased in areas where they managed to get councillors elected in the last lot of local elections. People wising up maybe.
The politicians need to stop shaking their heads and shrugging their shoulders about the reason for BNPs Euro success. They have to debate/acknowledge the immigration concerns of people on the street, until they do BNP will exploit these concerns for their own agenda.
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| Rocke |
If you read Agent Smith's letter in this week's Gazette you'll think Labour walked it in BG. Unfortunately the European elections constituency is SE Wales, not BG. People's Voice is unique to our area ( there's some over in Torfaen ). When Agent Smith and les braves - or is it moutons ? - mount their assault on this bastion of democracy he'll find it a different ball game. It'll probably end up as People's Voice, people's choice, not love my Labour. |
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| Rocke |
Totally agree there Ian. What I say to those who are so jarred off with politics and politicians that they say they won't bother voting is this: Voting is not simply about putting an X in a box. It's more important to exercise your right to vote, as an acknowledgement of the sacrifices made by generations that have gone before. If you don't like any of the candidates simply exercise your right to a ballot paper and return it blank. Although that would still have the effect of letting in odious examples of some of the dregs of British society it is at least an expression of gratitude, for the many forms of sacrifice made and the many hardships endured so that our democracy could. |
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| Rocke |
In my ( considerable ) experience 'pub talk' usually gets around to not only immigration but Uk-born and bred citizens who due to the miracles of genetics have the characteristics of their ancestors, who might not have been born and/or bred here. Almost every time it happens I ask one question - 'what about our Carribean friends then ? We had a labour shortage in the 50's and 60's so we offered West Indians the chance of a new life. Has there been any trouble with them ?' And of course people suddenly take a step back and realise. Just watching Gordon Brown denigrating the BNP, yet he's the one to blame for failing to prevent MPs upsetting the electorate so much. Any port in a storm as they say. The problem is that BNP harbour is on the same island as Lost is set. |
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| Saeson |
I shan`t name names, but you might be surprised who votes for the BNP. They are often seen as a party fighting for British jobs and British people, but whose publicity deliberately leaves out the word `white`; it`s there though, between the lines. Most people who vote for them can`t or won`t see it.
As for immigrants, most of them are from the EU and are quite free to come over here to work, just as we are free to go over there and snap up their cheap houses (as Daily Mail readers will know) thus pricing the locals out of their own towns. |
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| Rocke |
As a Daily Mail reader who's worked abroad ( no, I don't have a second home in Brussels - nor Ebbw Vale for that matter ) I agree with the last part of your post. The first part I think shows the quandary we're all in when it comes to protect what Britain is and try to return to what Great Britain was. Because of our society and the way we were our country has been able to withstand all potentially fatal onslaughts that would have left the entire world a terrible place to live. That bulldog spirit didn't disappear, nor even diminish, with the immigration programmes and projects we initiated in the 50's and 60's. Indeed, as late as the mid-70's Love Thy Neighbour and good old Alf were being shown without any problems at all. And we were in the forefront of the fight against apartheid, which we helped defeat, and the misuse of communism that was used as a tool to subjugate nations. I'll never forget being able to say to an Iraqi workmate of mine who'd played a trick on me 'now come on Tariq, play the white man'. Enoch Powell is roundly condemned as a racist yet his rivers of blood was radical, and regrettably proved correct. * If the BNP had a 'road to Damascus' transformation and accepted that British people are now a diverse bunch; and * if the rest of us - most notably the Government of the day ( who rely on our support ) - refused to put up with those who chose to put themselves outside our code of conduct ; or * more importantly didn't have to fear speaking out and/or acting against those who chose to attack our way of life and our ideals this would be Great Britain once again. I don't hate people from Northern Ireland because a relatively minute proportion of them tried to browbeat us into giving the province up. I've no worries about saying that I supported what seemed to be a hidden agenda to slaughter those caught in the act, as in Gibraltar and I'm not in the least bit concerned that sons, brothers, fathers, uncles might have gone down to the farm to check on an arms stash, only to return in a body bag. Now guess what would happen if I gave my views on Al Qaeda members........... Anyway, to come back to a less emotive means of trying to put my point across. In the past this country's been able to stand up because it's been relatively rich, because it's been united and because it's been respected throughout the world. Now we're almost bankrupt, a significant reason being due to the huge cost of sustaining a welfare state for far more people than it was intended ( and probably should be providing for ), we're riven with racists ( don't forget it's now racist to treat someone as a 'white honkey' as well ) and no-one respects us after our little forays over the past 20 years or so. In a nutshell ? The BNP stands for all that is wrong in Britain, but don't forget that there are parallels to them riddled all over society. Blue Mink were right, all those years ago. We do need a great big melting pot. Trouble is white anti-fascists would demonstrate when it was a non-white's turn, the BNP would violently prevent a non-white cook from mixing in a sprinkling of whites, Islamics would prevent the process on Fridays, Jews would on Saturdays and the Christians would insist that everyone rested on the Seventh Day. Not so much a mad world as a maddening one. |
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| hedleymccarthy |
I wonder how many of my fellow councillors contribute from their special levy to the admirable Abertillery based organisation Welcome to Wales who do good things to promote understanding and to break down language barriers ? | ||||||||
| martyn142 |
Who runs that organisation Hedley - a genuine question as I've never heard of it? |
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| hedleymccarthy |
It is actually very near to where you live Martyn, I feel it is probably inappropriate to give details online in the current political climate, with the warped views this subject attracts and the rise of the racist right. If you contact me with Personal message I would of course give you the information as I'm sure you would agree that this initiative should be applauded and that we should as we have traditionally done keep a welcome in the hillside. 
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| IAN(boco)jones |
Exactly how is someone supposed to contribute to an organisation if it's barely heard of and made secret by the very person promoting it. i understand your concerns of racism cllr, but i take it they are a charitable organisation so the more publicity the better. |
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| hedleymccarthy |
I would not be prepared to give someone's name without their consent on a matter like this, however, I will endeavour to get that consent. I believe all councillors are aware of the organisation and maybe some would be less cautious than I ? | ||||||||
| Rocke |
Whichever one's at the keyboard is talking of an organisation that extends good old-fashioned Welsh welcomes to people from abroad that are living and/or working in Aber, most notably Polski. There's been a few times when I've been in 'pub talks' and 'Poles' have become the topic of conversation. Just like I've mentioned before, regarding pointing out that no-one in their right mind regards Brits with 'West Indian characteristics' as anything other than Brits I always point out a few facts about our Polish friends, because they and their country are just that. Life's hard there but they work hard. It's not often that you read or hear of unemployed Poles claiming hundreds in benefits. And in case anyone doesn't know, when their country was overrun they poured over here, not for shelter but to join with us ( primarily with the RAF ) to start the fightback. It's very ironic that the spitfire featured on some of the BNP's recent literature is actually from a Polish RAF squadron, I think one that had one of the highest number of kills. Poland is home to the most damnable place on Earth and for me it will always be associated first and foremost with Oswiecim ( for that is what it was called before the nazis insisted on the German name Auschwitz ). However 'Poles' or 'Polish' will for me always remind me of Oosterbeek, a short distance from Arnhem. Visit there, and see how their young people and ours lie together in the same surprisingly small but immaculate cemetery. Good people, Polski. And if you see them in a pub, say 'nostrovia !'. That's how to show them a warm Valleys welcome. n-o ( the o is pronounced as in 'off' ) - st - ro (pronounced as in Ro-bert ) - vee-a. It means 'cheers', btw. Great way of breaking the ice. |
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| Rocke |
Easy to pay with someone else's money isn't it ? And easy to imply that you're doing so ( difficult to know who 'you' are of course ). For the benefit of our viewers, BG councillors are allocated some £1,100 per year to distribute to good causes and organisations in the Borough. Some of you might send letters to councillors asking for a donation to an organisation you're associated with. I'll be up front about it now. It does have its uses in that small - but helpful - amounts can be given directly to help what and whoever benefits the community. However, I consider it the nearest thing to making oneself look good to the electorate. The number of times I've heard 'so-and-so never gave us a cheque this year' or 'we always have ( a particular sum ) from members'. I've actually had one prominent member of society tell me that Borough councillors always donate £100 ( to a particular thing ). Also, we're limited to only dishing it out on a pro-rata basis. ie. a maximum of almost £100 up to the end of April, £200 up to May 31st etc. This leads to a potential imbalance in that if there's 6 requests in April I can only allot an average of £16 each. Yet if no-one requests anything after Christmas there could be £300 sat there. I made an early decision to wait until the end of the ( financial ) year so I could ensure as far as possible that all requests could be met. ( It's why almost everyone that has asked hasn't yet had anything - my personal admin's a little behind ). I find it a little unpalatable that 'hedleymccarthy' is attempting to put into the public domain the idea that they have a charitable side. If their posting is completely kosher, it's your money anyway. Also, why not say who it benefits - or are you afraid that the fascists won't vote for you ? That, I can definitely say, is the least of your worries. |
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| hedleymccarthy |
Hi Martyn I realigned postings to explain my reticence I think you will understand. | ||||||||
| DavidLL |
The organisation Witamy w Walii (Welcome to Wales) was established by a well-qualified (to do so), experienced individual with the support of Communities First partnerships in the Ebbw Fach valley and others.
The service they provide to migrants from Poland and other countries is excellent and far from the being the supposed 'spongers' that some on here might portray such migrants, the truth is they are largely hard-working individuals and families who just want to earn their way in the world. The conditions they often work under would not be palatable or acceptable to many (most) people from this country, so it is not a gravy train............ The organisation helps with practical matters and language lessons etc. There is in my opinion the need for a serious debate on immigration in this country, which will hopefully flush out the far right with their despicable aims and ideas. The fact is that economic migration is largely cyclical and the majority of migrants often return home - Auf Wiedersehen Pet from the early 80s should be mandatory viewing to see not only one of the finest programmes on British TV but the serious message it portrays that our workers at that time were the economic migrants of Europe. I suspect if the recession lasts longer here than mainland Europe, that will once again be the case. For those migrants who stay, most often they contribute positively to the economy and culture of the countries they end up in. The whole of the USA was based on that. |
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| hedleymccarthy |
Hear, Hear well said I agree with every word. | ||||||||
| Rocke |
Then why didn't you ( whichever one it was ) say so in the first place ? btw I have it on good authority that certain councillors have been exercising their right to use the civic vehicle and chauffeur. |
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